As I understand it, we’re still waiting for a final word on the motives of the man who murdered Dr. George Tiller, the noted late-term abortionist. But indications seem to be that the killer was motivated by his anti-abortion (I won’t say pro-life) beliefs.
I’m appalled by this wicked, perverse and un-Christian act. The perpetrator, if and when convicted, should be punished to the full extent of the law.
I don’t know what else there is to say.
I do not want to support the murder of Dr. Tiller, but I would like to offer a parallel example that I cannot resolve and one that keeps troubling me. If you can, I would appreciate your help.
It is the example of Bonhoeffer’s struggle with his conscience and his faith in Christ over Hitler’s cruelty and extermination of Jews and others in Nazi Germany. He finally choose to be part of a failed assassination attempt upon Hitler.
I do not want to compare the men (obviously, it’s not a fair comparison), but the dilemma. What do you do when you see that someone is above the law (no one can lift a finger to stop them) and numerous people are dying daily as a result of that person’s actions? Is this not the dilemma Bonhoeffer faced and wrestled with for a long time? Was not Bonhoeffer willing to die as a consequence of his decision to try to stop Hitler’s atrocities?
Is this not the same type of dilemma that Christians consciences’ face with abortion? We do not think it is right to assassinate Tiller, but we cannot passively stand by as numerous children are daily being lawfully slaughtered. It troubles me.
I cannot support vigilantism. I cannot support allowing the daily slaughter of children – yet that is what is happening with no hope of changing the laws anytime in the near future. And I see the culture of death growing in the form of assisted suicide and the probable duty to die if the Obama nationalized medicine is allowed to pass. It all troubles me. Any thoughts?
The comparison b/w Bohoeffer’s dilemma and ours doesn’t work, because a dictator and national leader like Hitler is not nearly the same as a man doing something awful within the confines of the law. As pro-lifers, we aren’t in a legal battle so much as we are in a cultural battle. Make abortion unlawful tomorrow, and the culture of death will not be changed. It will only be challenged.
In a situation like this, where a man walked into a church and killed another man, even if the murderer was completely justified morally (meaning the law was immoral and this man was challenging an evil government), I think Jesus would respond as he did with Peter after he cut off the ear of a priest’s servant. He told him to put his sword away, and later he said if his kingdom was of this world, his people would fight in this world.
Here’s another dilemma, less of a political hot button. If someone killed one or more pimps in Atlanta and liberated a dozen prostitutes, including enslaved children, from an evil brothel in that city, what would we say? Is that the same scenario as this? Is killing the slave owners the line one cannot cross?
Excellent points, Phil. I think you answered better than I would have.
A further point, and not a trivial one, is simply the utilitarian one. The murderer has turned this monster into a martyr, and so furthered the cause of death. He should have had the brains to recognize that that would be the result.
Vigilantism often leads to counter-vigilantism and eventually a civil war. Therefore, I’d say it is only justified if things are so bad a civil war would be an improvement.
The pedophilia pimps are a different case because they don’t have enough support to start a civil war. Also, it would be stopping a crime in progress (you use deadly force to let the children escape) instead of reacting not during a crime.
It seems that when I was a kid, decades ago, I saw at someone’s house a pamphlet or book called Damned Through the Church, or something like that. Who knows what kind or ranting it may have contained?
But that title keeps coming to my mind lately in connection with the mainline churches, and especially the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America, which is ubiquitous in this part of the country. Today I’m thinking of the late Dr. Tiller. Here he was, an usher in an ELCA church. No doubt his checks appeared in the offering plate.
People knew who he was and what he did for a living. His pastor presumably included him in a liturgical absolution of sin and gave him the church’s Lord’s Supper.
Did Dr. Tiller quieten his conscience with the help of this church?
Maybe so, but I wouldn’t doubt he fully believed unborn children are not people at all. He may have tried not to think about it, being willfully blind.
Thank you all for your help, but I am still struggling with this.
If my understanding is correct, I cannot agree that Hitler was acting outside of his nation’s laws anymore than I could agree that Obama is acting outside our nation’s laws. It is my understanding that everything Hitler did was ‘lawful’. The situation does remind me of abortion in the USA. Unwanted children and unwanted Jews… and governments who provide a solution to the ‘problem’ through the clothing of laws.
I have difficulty comparing murder to prostitution or slavery. All are evil, but the practice of abortion ends a life whereas the practice of prostitution and slavery usually does not. As it stands now, abortion is the genocide of large numbers of several generations. I cannot condone assassinating abortionists nor can I condone passivity. In the face of my neighbors losing their lives, what should I do? (All of my congressional reps are pro-life so there is nothing to do there)
I have trouble reconciling passivity when my neighbors are being murdered. If my understanding is correct, I cannot use the example of Peter, the soldier, and Christ to remain passive. The event applied to Christ facing his appointed death and the kingdom of God and the gospel. I think we are all clear that the kingdom of God is different from the kingdom of man. Abortion is a kingdom of man situation is it not? It is not an immoral law of men that needs to be changed?
I’m not convinced that abortion should only be seen as part of the culture war and not a legal battle. I think it is a situation where the rule of law is needed to curb evil. My impression of the culture war is that it is a struggle between those who want to restore traditional customs and moral standards to our nation and those who want to abandon these historical virtues. Unfortunately, some of the issues are legal battles (eg: abortion, gay marriage, etc.).
I agree that Tiller’s murder was politically stupid. I wish is had not happened, but I can understand how appalled someone might be when Tiller walked away a freeman from 19 charges related to his abortion practice. I can understand why one man was assassinated to prevent the murders of more children even if I cannot condone it. I wish it was illegal except under dire circumstances. Anyway, thanks for trying to help me wrestle with this subject.
SjB: It is my understanding that everything Hitler did was ‘lawful’. The situation does remind me of abortion in the USA.
Ori: The big difference is that in Germany there was no way to remedy the situation short of violence. The law was changed to where no peaceful solution could have gotten rid of the Nazis. We are not in that situation – we’re allowed to say that abortion is wrong, and there is no S.S. to come pick us up in the middle of the night. Therefore, we don’t need to resort to tactics that cause civil wars.
I don’t think any lives will be saved by Tiller’s murder, BTW. The parents would just go to a different provider.
God’s commands in the Old Testament cover slavery, oppressing the poor and foreigners, and many other things. Even though what you say, SjB, makes sense, God took a hard line with many things when giving us the law. But the application for us is the Lord’s reminder that vengeance is His alone. There were opportunities in the New Testament culture as the church was growing for Paul, Peter, or John to instruct a church in how to take up the sword against those who leave their children on the roadside to die or who kill fellow believers for whatever reason. Those instructions are not in the Bible. So Lars’ title is still our line in this situation. Our weapons are not of this world. We pray Psalm 10 against Planned Parenthood and their ilk, calling on the Lord to act because he will bring the victory that counts.
Of course with an org. like Planned Parenthood, lawsuits and exposes can be done to bring them down.
“The law was changed to where no peaceful solution could have gotten rid of the Nazis. We are not in that situation – we’re allowed to say that abortion is wrong, and there is no S.S. to come pick us up in the middle of the night.”
The law has been changed so that there is no peaceful way to get rid of abortion. The law might be changed; the regime might have been changed in Germany. The law did in any case bring Hitler lawfully to power.
It’s no good saying that we get a vote. The Jews might have gotten a vote in the matter without being served by it. A vote is a wonderful thing when you have a majority or the sympathy of your fellow men.
There’s no SS to come get us in the middle of the night, that’s true. Instead there are abortion doctors to destroy more helpless creatures behind closed doors.
The distinction between the abuse of Jews and the abuse of children is one not of morals but of recognition.
Still, John, do we not agree that violence is not the way to win the pro-life battle in America? Do we not agree that vandalism, killing clinic staff, or destroying buildings is immoral even in the cause of saving children’s lives?
Like I said before, we could make abortion illegal tomorrow, and the culture of death would not be changed. Taking the lives of medical murderers into our own hands is not the way God wants us to fight. Even when the Lord directs select criminals to be put to death, he didn’t say that if anyone happens to find his neighbor in one of these deadly sins he should take on himself to execute them. He prescribed an organized method for capital punishment. In our day, that’s the government’s job. We can’t kill anyone justly on our own.
But we can run pregnancy clinics, marriage and family ministries, and crisis relationship mentoring and workshops. We can urge our governors and representatives to promote justice and life. We can take over or start a fair-minded, even Christian, news organization that will tell the truth. We can serve on city boards and councils so that we vote down abortion clinics or zone them out or demand responsible medical accountability for them (apparently they are lacking in that area).
We cannot kill people though! We cannot take that form of justice into our own hands! God does not allow it.
Dr. Paul T. McCain publishes Uwe Siemon-Netto’s argument on the subject here.
I can’t believe it’s God’s desire that our enemies should fear violence from us.
Let me start with a few of the facts associated with Tiller that keep troubling me as I ponder Tiller’s death:
Tiller’s clinic is 1 of only 3 clinics nationwide that performs late-term abortions. Tiller boasted (yes, boasted) that he had performed over 60,000 late-term abortions (fetuses over 24 weeks old) since 1973. 60,000 is only a portion of the total abortions Tiller performed. Tiller’s annual salary for performing abortions was around $1 million dollars. Medical reports confirm that the reasons used for the majority of late-term abortions are not valid.
Tiller boasted that he bought government support/protection with his political donations. Gov. Sebellius (2002-2009) vetoed several legislation bills passed by the Kansas legislature to remedy late-term abortion and unsanitary clinic conditions while she was in office. The fight in Kansas to legally address abortion has been going on for a long time.
It is because of these facts that I have trouble associating the assassination of Tiller with vengeance. When I look at Tiller’s record, his murderer looks more like a man who could no longer bear the situation. Hence in my mind, it looks like an act of vigilantism to stop evil not vengeance. I find I cannot condone Tiller’s assassination, but based on the facts, I find I cannot completely condemn it either. I’ve read a number of good articles condemning the act of assassinating a mass murderer, but I still cannot resolve my dilemma. I cannot condemn the end of Tiller’s reign as a purveyor of death. I find myself thankful for the lives that may escape because of his death.
I cannot and do not advocate any kind of violence, but something seems to be missing as I read some articles. I find myself almost recoiling from the pious platitudes about peaceful praying and silent vigils while children are being murdered by the thousands daily. Some articles strike me as almost holier-than-thou with the stink of superiority to Tiller’s killer. An almost faux holiness of being above the fray that seems inane in the face of mass murder. A pseudo pious stance that cloaks passivity? Are we guilty of patting ourselves on the back with a bunch of pious feel-good nonsense that insists on being the Christian version of politically correct? Are we pious hypocrites condemning abortion while refusing to act? At what point do we get off our knees and do something to end the violence of abortion? Are we guilty of neglect in the face of genocide? I cannot answer these questions.
It is true that there are not specific instructions in the bible to address every injustice. But we are told that our faith is useless without works. We are told that it is not godliness to pray for our brothers instead of providing food and clothing for them.
It is God’s general commands to protect and care for others that I wrestle with. It is true that our weapons are not of this world and I would never advocate neglecting this, but it is also true that God demands that we act and work too. I guess these are the things I am wrestling with for I do not believe we are to only pray and not take actions to defend and care for others.
As far as I can tell, we are not being persecuted for our faith in Christ where we do not pick up the sword, we are trying to protect children and end genocide. I wish I had answers that gave my heart peace. I feel as guilty as the German people under Hitler who did nothing while thousands died daily in the death camps. It does not seem to be enough to be involved in pro-life clinics trying to save a few lives here and there. But I suppose that is the best that can be done for now. I do appreciate everyone’s input.
SjB, I appreciate your honesty and talking this through here. I want to ask you for clarity now. You say, “At what point do we get off our knees and do something to end the violence of abortion?” and that “God demands that we act and work too.” The only option you seem to apply that idea to is murdering the abortionist, despite having said you don’t condone it. Is your real question then why isn’t killing the murderer a viable Christian action, that is, something God wants us to do?
In answer to my question, I think Psalm 10 & 83 give us answers. We are to cry out to the Lord for justice and let him judge as he wishes. Tiller is paying for his sins now, but the lawyers, Governor Sibelius, and others who were paid off by the abortion lobby will be judged too. God has not given us the option to take a man’s life in our own hands like this.
Sure, we live in maddening times! How the hell can so many people believe idiotic ideas like this, that unborn children are not people with rights–are not children to be protected? But we do live in these times. Christians and God-fearing non-Christians must fight as God would have us to fight. There are many things to do, and prayer is a big one of them–the most important. Murdering abortionists is not something we can do. Vengenace, taking up the justice of the Lord, is God’s responsibility.
Thanks Phil for your thoughts. I am frustrated. I do not want to harm abortionists, but I would like them to either come to their senses or hog tie them until abortion can be ended legally. Perhaps I’m a frustrated kidnapper? 🙂
You are right about prayer. And I agree that it is all in God’s hands and he will judge evil. I can easily rest in that. There is also the instruction to snatch some from the fire and etc. That’s where my wrestling comes into the picture. The lives of innocent children are at stake and I do not think God means for us to stand idly and not attempt to address evil.
What I meant in the comments you asked about is that after one prays one normally acts/works in our vocations. As a citizen, what can I do? My frustration is probably related to how little I can do and recently, the small laws restricting abortion have been removed. The numbers of children dying daily is heart breaking.
I may be wrong here, but I distinguish between vengeance (revenge for something done to you personally) and vigilantism (law enforcement without legal authority). In my mind, there is a difference. Vengeance is never right and vigilantism is rarely right, but sometimes it is right (eg: stopping a robber/burglar in the act).
Vengeance is more than personal. Deut. 32:33-36:
And in Romans 12, I don’t think Paul is restricting these commands to personal conduct.
I think I understand your point. Thanks.
Ok. I hope I didn’t go overboard in making it. It can be easy to say too much on a blog.